911 Records of Inbound-Only TNs
Are you setting up 911 records for all numbers assigned to customers or just ones that would be dialing out? We pull customer numbers all of the time that served no original purpose other than for a legacy operator that needed to put a phone number on every line a customer had. We keep them because people likely saved those ancillary numbers in their contact lists, and it's just easier to port it than to fight "Billy can't reach me because he saved an old number that YOU canceled" tickets. However, no one will ever call out of that number - it's inbound only. We're trying to figure out what to do with all of those numbers from a 911 perspective. If no one would ever call out of that number, there's no technical need to have it. I'm not sure what would legally or best practices required of it. ----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Midwest Internet Exchange http://www.midwest-ix.com
On Tue, Mar 21, 2023 at 11:55?AM Mike Hammett via VoiceOps < voiceops at voiceops.org> wrote:
Are you setting up 911 records for all numbers assigned to customers or just ones that would be dialing out?
We pull customer numbers all of the time that served no original purpose other than for a legacy operator that needed to put a phone number on every line a customer had. We keep them because people likely saved those ancillary numbers in their contact lists, and it's just easier to port it than to fight "Billy can't reach me because he saved an old number that YOU canceled" tickets. However, no one will ever call out of that number - it's inbound only. We're trying to figure out what to do with all of those numbers from a 911 perspective. If no one would ever call out of that number, there's no technical need to have it. I'm not sure what would legally or best practices required of it.
Are you selling "interconnected VoIP" associated with these DIDs? -jbn
A maybe simpler example to what you are asking would be TEEN lines, where calling the TEEN number makes the parent station ring with a distinctive pattern. The subscriber has no way of making an outbound call with that TEEN number. Should we bother setting up a 911 record for that TEEN number? You could argue either way. If systems are automated and storing the extra records has little to no costs, then might as well create a 911 record for it. We have some numbers where it's hard to determine what the 911 location would even be. For example, a DN you call that just reads you back what phone number you are calling from. The address of the building that has that server? But that number will never call me back, and will certainly never call 911. It sounds defensible to not create a 911 record for a number like that. Remote Call Forwarding numbers would be another example. All they ever do is forward a call to another pre-determined number.
I'd say that the only way it will come up is if someone calls 911 and there's no record found or a misroute. If there's no possible way to call out from that number to 911, then there's no need to place a 911 record in the databases. There will never be an audit that tries to check every number someone has to see if it has a 911 record, because vast amounts of customer number types have no discernable 911 address or meaningful way to process a 911 call, and depending on the technology, what instead will happen is a real time call positioning system synthesizes a record, assigns a pANI, and forwards a call to the PSAP with it, so no real database ever existed for nomadic voip calls like that, and never would. Mobile works this way, and some nomadic voip systems do too. -Paul ________________________________ From: VoiceOps <voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org> on behalf of Mike Hammett via VoiceOps <voiceops at voiceops.org> Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2023 12:55 PM To: VoiceOps Subject: [VoiceOps] 911 Records of Inbound-Only TNs Are you setting up 911 records for all numbers assigned to customers or just ones that would be dialing out? We pull customer numbers all of the time that served no original purpose other than for a legacy operator that needed to put a phone number on every line a customer had. We keep them because people likely saved those ancillary numbers in their contact lists, and it's just easier to port it than to fight "Billy can't reach me because he saved an old number that YOU canceled" tickets. However, no one will ever call out of that number - it's inbound only. We're trying to figure out what to do with all of those numbers from a 911 perspective. If no one would ever call out of that number, there's no technical need to have it. I'm not sure what would legally or best practices required of it. ----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Midwest Internet Exchange http://www.midwest-ix.com
The underlying issue here is that 9-1-1 calls originate from *stations*... and not all DNs are actually associated with a station. If it's not, I see no reason to map it for 911 calls, cause nothing should ever hit the PSAP with that ANI. Teen Lines are a special case of this, since they really *are* associated with a station, but *still* won't ever originate a call, cause that's not how the switch is programmed... Cheers, -- jra ----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Timmins via VoiceOps" <voiceops at voiceops.org> To: "Mike Hammett" <voiceops at ics-il.net> Cc: "VoiceOps" <voiceops at voiceops.org> Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2023 3:16:43 PM Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] 911 Records of Inbound-Only TNs
I'd say that the only way it will come up is if someone calls 911 and there's no record found or a misroute.
If there's no possible way to call out from that number to 911, then there's no need to place a 911 record in the databases.
There will never be an audit that tries to check every number someone has to see if it has a 911 record, because vast amounts of customer number types have no discernable 911 address or meaningful way to process a 911 call, and depending on the technology, what instead will happen is a real time call positioning system synthesizes a record, assigns a pANI, and forwards a call to the PSAP with it, so no real database ever existed for nomadic voip calls like that, and never would. Mobile works this way, and some nomadic voip systems do too.
-Paul
From: VoiceOps <voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org> on behalf of Mike Hammett via VoiceOps <voiceops at voiceops.org> Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2023 12:55 PM To: VoiceOps Subject: [VoiceOps] 911 Records of Inbound-Only TNs Are you setting up 911 records for all numbers assigned to customers or just ones that would be dialing out?
We pull customer numbers all of the time that served no original purpose other than for a legacy operator that needed to put a phone number on every line a customer had. We keep them because people likely saved those ancillary numbers in their contact lists, and it's just easier to port it than to fight "Billy can't reach me because he saved an old number that YOU canceled" tickets. However, no one will ever call out of that number - it's inbound only. We're trying to figure out what to do with all of those numbers from a 911 perspective. If no one would ever call out of that number, there's no technical need to have it. I'm not sure what would legally or best practices required of it.
----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com
Midwest Internet Exchange http://www.midwest-ix.com
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participants (5)
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jra＠baylink.com -
justin＠ejtown.org -
mjohnston＠wiktel.com -
ptimmins＠clearrate.com -
voiceops＠ics-il.net