Hi All, A question for you that I've never been able to get an answer too. We are a small hosted VOIP shop. And we port numbers through various aggregators (example vitelity) When we are porting phone numbers I am occasionally asked for a CSR by the gaining carrier (Or the aggregator that we are using). Sometimes they are able to get the CSR and sometimes they are not. However, when I call the losing carrier they always state that they don't give out CSR's. And that the winning carrier needs to request the CSR. One of the two parties is giving bad information , and I can't ever tell which one. Are there rules that govern the CSR requests? If there a way that we can ever do a CSR request without going through the consumer channels? Thanks David
You need to send a letter of authorization signed by the customer along with the request for the CSR to the losing carrier. The losing carrier has a right to request an LOA before they release any information, but when you provide the LOA they are obligated to send it to you because you are acting on the customer's behalf. Mary Lou Carey BackUP Telecom Consulting marylou at backuptelecom.com Office: 615-791-9969 x 2001 -----Original Message----- From: voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org [mailto:voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org] On Behalf Of David Wessell Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 12:16 PM To: voiceops at voiceops.org Subject: [VoiceOps] CSR Request? Hi All, A question for you that I've never been able to get an answer too. We are a small hosted VOIP shop. And we port numbers through various aggregators (example vitelity) When we are porting phone numbers I am occasionally asked for a CSR by the gaining carrier (Or the aggregator that we are using). Sometimes they are able to get the CSR and sometimes they are not. However, when I call the losing carrier they always state that they don't give out CSR's. And that the winning carrier needs to request the CSR. One of the two parties is giving bad information , and I can't ever tell which one. Are there rules that govern the CSR requests? If there a way that we can ever do a CSR request without going through the consumer channels? Thanks David _______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
Mary, Wouldn't the winning CLEC representing the reseller have to send the LOA with the a CSR request? I have numerous run ins with TW Telecom where I was attempting to port a customer number that was with a reseller and they sometimes ignored the LOA since it didn't match the customer on record. Thus I thought the point of the CSR is to determine the customer on record before submitting an LSR request. Regards, Erik Flournoy 808-426-4527 301-218-7325 CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This e-mail message, including any attachments from EESPRO.com - contain information which is CONFIDENTIAL AND/OR LEGALLY PRIVILEGED. The information is intended only for the use of the individual named above and may not be disseminated to any other party without written permission. If you are not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, disclosure, distribution, copying or taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this e-mailed information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately notify info at eespro.com, and permanently delete this e-mail and the attachments hereto, if any, and destroy any printout thereof. On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:53 AM, Mary Lou Carey <marylou at backuptelecom.com>wrote:
You need to send a letter of authorization signed by the customer along with the request for the CSR to the losing carrier. The losing carrier has a right to request an LOA before they release any information, but when you provide the LOA they are obligated to send it to you because you are acting on the customer's behalf.
Mary Lou Carey BackUP Telecom Consulting marylou at backuptelecom.com Office: 615-791-9969 x 2001
-----Original Message----- From: voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org [mailto:voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org] On Behalf Of David Wessell Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 12:16 PM To: voiceops at voiceops.org Subject: [VoiceOps] CSR Request?
Hi All,
A question for you that I've never been able to get an answer too.
We are a small hosted VOIP shop. And we port numbers through various aggregators (example vitelity)
When we are porting phone numbers I am occasionally asked for a CSR by the gaining carrier (Or the aggregator that we are using). Sometimes they are able to get the CSR and sometimes they are not.
However, when I call the losing carrier they always state that they don't give out CSR's. And that the winning carrier needs to request the CSR.
One of the two parties is giving bad information , and I can't ever tell which one. Are there rules that govern the CSR requests? If there a way that we can ever do a CSR request without going through the consumer channels?
Thanks David
_______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
_______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
If you have access into some of the bigger carriers provisioning systems sometimes you can pull the CSRs directly from that, but otherwise the only way to get a CSR is to request it from the losing carrier. (The losing carrier has to have a CSR so they know what to bill the end user customer for.) If they don't send you a CSR, it's most likely because the information you gave them is bad or you didn't provide the correct LOAs. Here's a few tips on how to make sure you have the right information and LOAs: 1. Ask the customer for a copy of their bill as sometimes the LEC will include the customer service record at the end of the customer's bill. If it's not there, then at the very least you can verify BAN (billing account number) and billing name. 2. The losing carrier does not have to provide you with a CSR if the billing name on the LOA doesn't match the billing name on the BAN so make sure the customer provides you with the correct billing name AND address as well as a letter of authorization to act on THEIR behalf. The carrier requesting the number port needs to have an LOA from the customer giving them authorization. When there is more than one carrier involved, the carrier with the end user contract needs to get an LOA from the end user so they can move the number to their network AND the carrier porting the number needs an LOA from the carrier with the contract so they can act on their behalf. 3. Note that sometimes the WTN (working telephone number) that you are trying to port is associated with a block of numbers. In this case, the WTN is associated with a BTN (billing telephone number) and many times the CSR may only be built for the BTN even though the BTN includes the WTN information! So when you review the customer's bill to verify the information, look to see if the phone number you want to port is associated with a BTN. 4. If all else fails, find the number for billing questions on the customer's bill and ask the client to be on the call with you so you can request the CSR be sent. They can refuse to send it to you, but they can't refuse to send it to their customer so worst case scenario your customer will have to order it and you'll have to pick up the information from them. Mary Lou Carey BackUP Telecom Consulting marylou at backuptelecom.com Office: 615-791-9969 x 2001 From: Erik Flournoy [mailto:erik at eespro.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 1:04 PM To: Mary Lou Carey Cc: David Wessell; voiceops at voiceops.org Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] CSR Request? Mary, Wouldn't the winning CLEC representing the reseller have to send the LOA with the a CSR request? I have numerous run ins with TW Telecom where I was attempting to port a customer number that was with a reseller and they sometimes ignored the LOA since it didn't match the customer on record. Thus I thought the point of the CSR is to determine the customer on record before submitting an LSR request. Regards, Erik Flournoy 808-426-4527 301-218-7325 CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This e-mail message, including any attachments from EESPRO.com - contain information which is CONFIDENTIAL AND/OR LEGALLY PRIVILEGED. The information is intended only for the use of the individual named above and may not be disseminated to any other party without written permission. If you are not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, disclosure, distribution, copying or taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this e-mailed information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately notify <mailto:info at eespro.com> info at eespro.com, and permanently delete this e-mail and the attachments hereto, if any, and destroy any printout thereof. On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:53 AM, Mary Lou Carey <marylou at backuptelecom.com> wrote: You need to send a letter of authorization signed by the customer along with the request for the CSR to the losing carrier. The losing carrier has a right to request an LOA before they release any information, but when you provide the LOA they are obligated to send it to you because you are acting on the customer's behalf. Mary Lou Carey BackUP Telecom Consulting marylou at backuptelecom.com Office: 615-791-9969 x 2001 -----Original Message----- From: voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org [mailto:voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org] On Behalf Of David Wessell Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 12:16 PM To: voiceops at voiceops.org Subject: [VoiceOps] CSR Request? Hi All, A question for you that I've never been able to get an answer too. We are a small hosted VOIP shop. And we port numbers through various aggregators (example vitelity) When we are porting phone numbers I am occasionally asked for a CSR by the gaining carrier (Or the aggregator that we are using). Sometimes they are able to get the CSR and sometimes they are not. However, when I call the losing carrier they always state that they don't give out CSR's. And that the winning carrier needs to request the CSR. One of the two parties is giving bad information , and I can't ever tell which one. Are there rules that govern the CSR requests? If there a way that we can ever do a CSR request without going through the consumer channels? Thanks David _______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops _______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 2:24 PM, Mary Lou Carey <marylou at backuptelecom.com>wrote:
4. If all else fails, find the number for billing questions on the customer's bill and ask the client to be on the call with you so you can request the CSR be sent. They can refuse to send it to you, but they can't refuse to send it to their customer so worst case scenario your customer will have to order it and you'll have to pick up the information from them.
We regularly have losing carriers tell our customer that they won't provide CSRs to the customer. Working on just such a situation right now. The company is Cablevision in NY. It seems like the cable companies are the worst ones to deal with, Cox is awful too. Maybe they think they are unregulated? Here's the actual transcript of the customer service person talking to the customer: Deshun T.: Hi, my name is Deshun T.. How may I help you? Eric Bonharme: I wish to port some of my phone numbers to another carrier. Can you please provide me with a CSR? Deshun T.: If you want to move your phone number to another provider you contact them and set it up with them and they contact us for you . Eric Bonharme: No, that's not what I've been told. This is what my new provider has sent me the following message: Eric Bonharme: Since we are porting in six numbers, we'll need the existing CSR information for those numbers. If you would call your existing carrier and tell them you need CSR to provide to your new carrier for number porting, they will understand that Deshun T.: Iwill double check for you now Deshun T.: There is a process that the other provider puts you the person claiming to own the phone numbers and if that is correct they submit the move. That's with any carrier any where. Deshun T.: If the other provider wants your phone numbers they do all the work contacting us, once you verify your becoming their customer, for all your lines. Deshun T.: Is there anything else that I can assist you with today, Eric? Eric Bonharme: Can you send me a transcript of this chat? Deshun T.: Sorry I can't but it is documented on your account for the record. -- Carlos Alvarez TelEvolve 602-889-3003
Carlos, The best way to handle this is to establish a relationship with the losing provider AND work with a CLEC that works with providers nicely. The problem you face is there are to many middle people. Everyone faces the problem you are facing including government agencies. I would recommend you getting your own SPID and establishing a relationship with the losing CLEC. Then with the winning CLEC ensure that your SPID is listed as an ALT SPID. When I worked at a CLEC in honolulu, hi a CLEC that we ported for insisted for those exact reasons. How will anyone know who owns a number if it's passing One CLEC and two resellers. Erik Flournoy 808-426-4527 301-218-7325 CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This e-mail message, including any attachments from EESPRO.com - contain information which is CONFIDENTIAL AND/OR LEGALLY PRIVILEGED. The information is intended only for the use of the individual named above and may not be disseminated to any other party without written permission. If you are not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, disclosure, distribution, copying or taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this e-mailed information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately notify info at eespro.com, and permanently delete this e-mail and the attachments hereto, if any, and destroy any printout thereof. On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:59 AM, Carlos Alvarez <carlos at televolve.com>wrote:
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 2:24 PM, Mary Lou Carey <marylou at backuptelecom.com
wrote:
4. If all else fails, find the number for billing questions on the customer's bill and ask the client to be on the call with you so you can request the CSR be sent. They can refuse to send it to you, but they can't refuse to send it to their customer so worst case scenario your customer will have to order it and you'll have to pick up the information from them.
We regularly have losing carriers tell our customer that they won't provide CSRs to the customer. Working on just such a situation right now. The company is Cablevision in NY. It seems like the cable companies are the worst ones to deal with, Cox is awful too. Maybe they think they are unregulated?
Here's the actual transcript of the customer service person talking to the customer:
Deshun T.: Hi, my name is Deshun T.. How may I help you? Eric Bonharme: I wish to port some of my phone numbers to another carrier. Can you please provide me with a CSR? Deshun T.: If you want to move your phone number to another provider you contact them and set it up with them and they contact us for you . Eric Bonharme: No, that's not what I've been told. This is what my new provider has sent me the following message: Eric Bonharme: Since we are porting in six numbers, we'll need the existing CSR information for those numbers. If you would call your existing carrier and tell them you need CSR to provide to your new carrier for number porting, they will understand that Deshun T.: Iwill double check for you now Deshun T.: There is a process that the other provider puts you the person claiming to own the phone numbers and if that is correct they submit the move. That's with any carrier any where. Deshun T.: If the other provider wants your phone numbers they do all the work contacting us, once you verify your becoming their customer, for all your lines. Deshun T.: Is there anything else that I can assist you with today, Eric? Eric Bonharme: Can you send me a transcript of this chat? Deshun T.: Sorry I can't but it is documented on your account for the record.
-- Carlos Alvarez TelEvolve 602-889-3003
_______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
First rule of dealing with carriers is that there is no such thing as easy! Second rule is never give them more information than they need to know, so if you are calling with the customer don't give them anymore information than "We're calling to get a copy of the CSR." If they ask why you need it, then tell them you are auditing their services. From my experience, anytime you say something about another carrier, you give them a reason not to be cooperative OR it confuses them! Mary Lou Carey BackUP Telecom Consulting marylou at backuptelecom.com Office: 615-791-9969 x 2001 From: voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org [mailto:voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org] On Behalf Of Carlos Alvarez Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 3:59 PM To: voiceops at voiceops.org Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] CSR Request? On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 2:24 PM, Mary Lou Carey <marylou at backuptelecom.com> wrote: 4. If all else fails, find the number for billing questions on the customer's bill and ask the client to be on the call with you so you can request the CSR be sent. They can refuse to send it to you, but they can't refuse to send it to their customer so worst case scenario your customer will have to order it and you'll have to pick up the information from them. We regularly have losing carriers tell our customer that they won't provide CSRs to the customer. Working on just such a situation right now. The company is Cablevision in NY. It seems like the cable companies are the worst ones to deal with, Cox is awful too. Maybe they think they are unregulated? Here's the actual transcript of the customer service person talking to the customer: Deshun T.: Hi, my name is Deshun T.. How may I help you? Eric Bonharme: I wish to port some of my phone numbers to another carrier. Can you please provide me with a CSR? Deshun T.: If you want to move your phone number to another provider you contact them and set it up with them and they contact us for you . Eric Bonharme: No, that's not what I've been told. This is what my new provider has sent me the following message: Eric Bonharme: Since we are porting in six numbers, we'll need the existing CSR information for those numbers. If you would call your existing carrier and tell them you need CSR to provide to your new carrier for number porting, they will understand that Deshun T.: Iwill double check for you now Deshun T.: There is a process that the other provider puts you the person claiming to own the phone numbers and if that is correct they submit the move. That's with any carrier any where. Deshun T.: If the other provider wants your phone numbers they do all the work contacting us, once you verify your becoming their customer, for all your lines. Deshun T.: Is there anything else that I can assist you with today, Eric? Eric Bonharme: Can you send me a transcript of this chat? Deshun T.: Sorry I can't but it is documented on your account for the record. -- Carlos Alvarez TelEvolve 602-889-3003
By the way, you should be able to tell the losing porting company by who the end user's LRN belongs to and you should be able to tell who the losing reseller is by looking at the bill the end user receives. Mary Lou Carey BackUP Telecom Consulting marylou at backuptelecom.com Office: 615-791-9969 x 2001 From: Erik Flournoy [mailto:erik at eespro.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 1:04 PM To: Mary Lou Carey Cc: David Wessell; voiceops at voiceops.org Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] CSR Request? Mary, Wouldn't the winning CLEC representing the reseller have to send the LOA with the a CSR request? I have numerous run ins with TW Telecom where I was attempting to port a customer number that was with a reseller and they sometimes ignored the LOA since it didn't match the customer on record. Thus I thought the point of the CSR is to determine the customer on record before submitting an LSR request. Regards, Erik Flournoy 808-426-4527 301-218-7325 CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This e-mail message, including any attachments from EESPRO.com - contain information which is CONFIDENTIAL AND/OR LEGALLY PRIVILEGED. The information is intended only for the use of the individual named above and may not be disseminated to any other party without written permission. If you are not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, disclosure, distribution, copying or taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this e-mailed information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately notify <mailto:info at eespro.com> info at eespro.com, and permanently delete this e-mail and the attachments hereto, if any, and destroy any printout thereof. On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:53 AM, Mary Lou Carey <marylou at backuptelecom.com> wrote: You need to send a letter of authorization signed by the customer along with the request for the CSR to the losing carrier. The losing carrier has a right to request an LOA before they release any information, but when you provide the LOA they are obligated to send it to you because you are acting on the customer's behalf. Mary Lou Carey BackUP Telecom Consulting marylou at backuptelecom.com Office: 615-791-9969 x 2001 -----Original Message----- From: voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org [mailto:voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org] On Behalf Of David Wessell Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 12:16 PM To: voiceops at voiceops.org Subject: [VoiceOps] CSR Request? Hi All, A question for you that I've never been able to get an answer too. We are a small hosted VOIP shop. And we port numbers through various aggregators (example vitelity) When we are porting phone numbers I am occasionally asked for a CSR by the gaining carrier (Or the aggregator that we are using). Sometimes they are able to get the CSR and sometimes they are not. However, when I call the losing carrier they always state that they don't give out CSR's. And that the winning carrier needs to request the CSR. One of the two parties is giving bad information , and I can't ever tell which one. Are there rules that govern the CSR requests? If there a way that we can ever do a CSR request without going through the consumer channels? Thanks David _______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops _______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
David, It appears the winning provider doesn't fully know the porting process of the losing provider. The losing provider will only provide CSR's to authorized CLEC with porting agreements. This becomes very difficult when you are trying to port a number from a reseller as the losing provider typically has no clue whom the number belongs too. Hope that helps. Erik Flournoy 808-426-4527 301-218-7325 CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This e-mail message, including any attachments from EESPRO.com - contain information which is CONFIDENTIAL AND/OR LEGALLY PRIVILEGED. The information is intended only for the use of the individual named above and may not be disseminated to any other party without written permission. If you are not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, disclosure, distribution, copying or taking of any action in reliance on the contents of this e-mailed information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, please immediately notify info at eespro.com, and permanently delete this e-mail and the attachments hereto, if any, and destroy any printout thereof. On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:16 AM, David Wessell <david at ringfree.biz> wrote:
Hi All,
A question for you that I've never been able to get an answer too.
We are a small hosted VOIP shop. And we port numbers through various aggregators (example vitelity)
When we are porting phone numbers I am occasionally asked for a CSR by the gaining carrier (Or the aggregator that we are using). Sometimes they are able to get the CSR and sometimes they are not.
However, when I call the losing carrier they always state that they don't give out CSR's. And that the winning carrier needs to request the CSR.
One of the two parties is giving bad information , and I can't ever tell which one. Are there rules that govern the CSR requests? If there a way that we can ever do a CSR request without going through the consumer channels?
Thanks David
_______________________________________________ VoiceOps mailing list VoiceOps at voiceops.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:16 AM, David Wessell <david at ringfree.biz> wrote:
However, when I call the losing carrier they always state that they don't give out CSR's. And that the winning carrier needs to request the CSR.
One of the two parties is giving bad information , and I can't ever tell which one. Are there rules that govern the CSR requests? If there a way that we can ever do a CSR request without going through the consumer channels?
This whole process is a mess and everybody is wrong except a few of the biggest carriers. We are the same type of company as you and we've heard the same things. We have been asking a customer for a copy of their bill to make it easy, but believe it or not, sometimes the important CSR info is different from the bill. We tried telling customers to request CSR from their own carrier, and about half of them refuse. We've tried sending LOAs to the losing carrier and about half just ignore us. Qwest/CenturyLink oddly has been the easiest to work with (didn't expect that) and Cox the absolute worst of all the majors. -- Carlos Alvarez TelEvolve 602-889-3003
Carlos! Nice to see you on this list too! In this particular case we are porting numbers from AT&T (bellsouth) into vitelity whom I am sure is using bandwidth.com<http://bandwidth.com>. Vitelity states that only the losing carrier can get the csr, and AT&T of course tells me that only the gaining carrier can request it. And the port sits in limbo. I'll go back and hammer at vitelity and see what I can get out of them. Thanks to everyone that confirmed there aren't standards on csr requests! :) ---- David Wessell 828-575-0030 http://ringfree.biz On Dec 11, 2012, at 2:04 PM, "Carlos Alvarez" <carlos at televolve.com<mailto:carlos at televolve.com>> wrote: On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:16 AM, David Wessell <david at ringfree.biz<mailto:david at ringfree.biz>> wrote: However, when I call the losing carrier they always state that they don't give out CSR's. And that the winning carrier needs to request the CSR. One of the two parties is giving bad information , and I can't ever tell which one. Are there rules that govern the CSR requests? If there a way that we can ever do a CSR request without going through the consumer channels? This whole process is a mess and everybody is wrong except a few of the biggest carriers. We are the same type of company as you and we've heard the same things. We have been asking a customer for a copy of their bill to make it easy, but believe it or not, sometimes the important CSR info is different from the bill. We tried telling customers to request CSR from their own carrier, and about half of them refuse. We've tried sending LOAs to the losing carrier and about half just ignore us. Qwest/CenturyLink oddly has been the easiest to work with (didn't expect that) and Cox the absolute worst of all the majors. -- Carlos Alvarez TelEvolve 602-889-3003
participants (4)
-
carlos＠televolve.com -
david＠ringfree.biz -
erik＠eespro.com -
marylou＠backuptelecom.com